Live from the Siburt Institute

Today's episode is a must-listen for anyone navigating spiritual exhaustion, burnout, or disillusionment.
 
Myles Werntz sits down with Anglican priest and author Tish Harrison Warren to chat about her book, What Grows in Weary Lands. Together, they dive into the reality of those unsettling seasons where God feels distant. Tish shares how her own season of weariness led her to draw wisdom from the fourth-century desert fathers and mothers, who wrote about spiritual dryness long ago. Rather than treating weariness as something to quickly fix with self-care or productivity hacks, she reframes the "desert" as a space to sit with our souls and be honest before God. The conversation highlights how people (especially leaders) often respond to exhaustion by either flaming out (through affairs, substance abuse, or renunciation of faith) or numbing out (through workaholism and constant distraction). Tish and Myles explore why we need to trade a transactional, "marketable" faith for a deeper acceptance of mystery. Ultimately, they offer a vision of Christian resilience anchored in honest relationships, sacramental worship, small daily joys, and a resurrection hope that assures us dry deserts will eventually bloom. 
 
Don't miss these three highlights in the conversation:
 
The Trap of "Flaming Out" or "Numbing Out": When faced with spiritual dryness or feeling like God is distant, people often react in two destructive ways. They either "flame out" through public meltdowns and scandals, or "numb out" through workaholism, minor vices, and constant distraction. Real growth happens when we stop hiding behind busywork and actually sit honestly with our inner struggles.
 
Rejecting "Marketable Christianity" for Mystery: Tish addresses the temptation to turn spiritual practices into a consumer app or a "spiritual prosperity gospel" that promises non-stop emotional high points if you put in the right work. True faith makes room for mystery, unfulfilled expectations, and seasons where God feels silent without assuming something has gone wrong.
 
Anchoring Resilience in Sacraments, Honest Community, and Daily Joy: Real Christian resilience goes much deeper than superficial self-care. It is built on transparent relationships where you have no secrets, participation in sacramental worship like the Eucharist, making space for simple everyday pleasures, and holding fast to a resurrection hope that transforms our current trials into eternal formation.
 
To connect with Tish, reach out to her here and you can order her newest book here.
 

What happens when a top-tier Bible scholar decides to write for eight-year-olds instead of just academics? In this episode, host Jennifer Schroeder sits down with Dr. Carmen Joy Imes to talk about her heart for children’s ministry and her latest book, Fierce and Faithful. Co-authored with Nijay K. Gupta, the book introduces kids to 25 incredible women from across the Bible, showing them that God has always used women to change the world.
Carmen shares some personal stories, like testing chapters at a family camping trip and getting vocabulary advice from her own nieces and nephews. She’s passionate about the idea that we shouldn’t "dumb down" the Bible for kids. Instead, she believes children are more than capable of handling deep theological truths and real history if we just take the time to explain it clearly.
It’s a beautiful reminder that our kids’ curiosity isn't a problem to be solved, but a bridge to a deeper faith. Whether you're a parent, a teacher, or just a lifelong learner, this conversation will inspire you to look at the Bible – and the children in your life – with fresh eyes.
Connect with Carmen:
Website: Carmenjoyimes.com
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCVM-Oq9H-LqH0RJJulhvjlg
Order Fierce and Faithful: https://www.ivpress.com/fierce-and-faithful?srsltid=AfmBOopLpOaaixKC5Jdzp6M-2zlOhcWRLYrvYXd9u69F4ZpvFc3Kk38B
Also mentioned in the podcast:
Curiously Kaitlyn podcast: https://www.holypost.com/articles/categories/curiously-kaitlyn
 

This episode features a conversation between Jennifer Schroeder, Laurie Templeton, and Holly Peeters regarding the CLAY (Christian Leaders Apprentice Youth) program at Singing Oaks Church of Christ.
Developed to address a lack of teen involvement in church, this model allows high schoolers to apprentice in various ministries – such as children's, worship, or Spanish – under the mentorship of experienced ministers.
Laurie, the children's minister at Singing Oaks, discusses the logistics involved, including interviews, contracts, and weekly spiritual formation meetings. Holly, a student who progressed from apprentice to intern, highlights how the experience revealed the "behind-the-scenes" of ministry, taught professional skills, and deepened her faith.
The model successfully keeps youth connected to the church during the summer and builds a sustainable pipeline for future congregational leadership.
To get in touch with Laurie, select her name from the drop down list and fill out the contact form here: https://singingoaks.org/contactKey Talking Points:The Definition of CLAY: An acronym for Christian Leaders Apprentice Youth, providing paid, part-time summer ministry experience for high school students.
Structured Mentorship: Apprentices undergo a professional application and interview process, sign contracts, and attend weekly meetings focused on spiritual growth and vocational reflection.
Fundraising: Students raise half of their stipend, which encourages church members to invest directly in the youth’s development and creates a sense of shared mission.
Intergenerational Relationships: CLAY is designed to foster intergenerational relationships within the church, by connecting the teens to children (through the children's ministry) and adults (through fundraising efforts).
Church Connectivity: The apprenticeship allows teens to earn money while remaining available for church camps and activities, unlike typical summer jobs.
Leadership Pipeline: The model serves as a "shoulder-tapping" tool to identify and train future church leaders and interns from within the local congregation.
 

In this episode of Live from the Siburt Institute, host Myles Werntz sits down with Eric Howell, pastor of Dayspring Baptist Church and author of Under the Francis Tree: A Practical Theology for the Church Grounds in the 21st Century.
Howell talks about his path from studying industrial engineering at Texas A&M to becoming a pastor with a deep interest in ecology and theology. His interest in the environment started with a high school club, but over time it became something deeper. He began to observe that God’s grace meets us through the material world (like baptismal water, communion bread and wine, and the other physical elements of worship).
A big part of the conversation is Howell’s challenge to the traditional idea of “stewardship.” He points out that stewardship can make us think of ourselves as middle managers who are simply taking care of property for an absentee landlord. Instead, he suggests thinking in terms of integration, participation, and worship.
Drawing on the Franciscan tradition, Howell sees the church not as standing apart from the rest of creation, but as joining the whole created world in praising God. He also draws on the work of Dr. Ellen Davis, who describes the biblical covenant as a “three-legged stool” involving God, people, and the land. (Find her book, Scripture, Culture, and Agriculture: An Agrarian Reading of the Bible, here.)
Howell shares some great examples of what this can look like in everyday church life. At Dayspring, a community composting project became an unexpected way to talk about reconciliation and resurrection during a pastoral conversation. He also tells the story of a San Antonio church that built a bird blind so people with Alzheimer’s could find therapeutic relief watching birds and connecting with the natural world.
Howell encourages churches to rediscover their sense of community by paying attention to and caring for the land right where they are.
Key Talking Points:
The Francis Tree Icon: The book’s title comes from a huge live oak at Dayspring Baptist Church. The tree has become a place for sunrise services, prayer, pastoral conversations, and care.
Rethinking Stewardship: Instead of seeing ourselves as managers of nature, Howell invites us to see ourselves as part of a larger community of creation that worships God together.
Sacramental Ecology: Baptismal water, communion bread and wine, and the other physical elements of worship are more than symbols. They remind us that God’s grace meets us through the material world.
The Eremocene: A term for our current age of “silence” and loneliness, brought on in part by our growing separation from the rhythms and patterns of the natural world.
Practical Parables: Everyday things like composting and bird watching can become powerful ways for churches to talk about big ideas like resurrection, reconciliation, and God’s care for creation.
The Sacred Grounds Project: A collaborative effort that helps congregations take small, practical steps toward turning the land they care for into a place of ministry, learning, and encounter with God.

Jennifer Schroeder talks with Wes Crawford about the challenges that American civil religion poses for Christians. They begin by discussing some of the manifestations of civil religion in the USA, before digging into the topic more deeply. An important part of the conversation is Dr. Crawford's upcoming book, One Nation Over God, to be published in fall 2026 by Eerdmans.  Among the resources that come up in the episode are:
Dr. Crawford's book One Nation Over God
Dr. Crawford's book Courage in the Sheer Silence
Dr. Crawford's book Shattering the Illusion 
Dr. Crawford's Substack - @wescrawford1

Jennifer Schroeder and Hannah Sutton-Adams discuss "Godly Play," an approach to engaging the Bible with children that seeks to find and make meaning through story, wonder, and play. They discuss how Godly Play nurtures children's spirituality honoring children's knowledge of God, capacity for wonder, and ability to ask and discuss deep questions. They also consider some of the challenges and opportunities that come for children's ministers and ministry volunteers.  Among the resources that come up in the episode are:
Rebecca Nye's Children's Spirituality: What It Is and Why It Matters
Ron Bruner and Dana Kennamer's Along the Way: Conversations about Children and Faith
The Godly Play foundation (website: godlyplayfoundation.org)
 

Myles Werntz talks with Julio Guarneri, the executive director of the Baptist Convention of Texas. Growing up in a ministerial environment, Julio moved to Texas as a teenager when his pastored in Texas and felt a call into ministry. After his time working in the local church, he became the executive director and talks with us about his experience in this role. He encourages all in the Baptist Convention, and those in the Church across the world, to develop partnerships to advance the kingdom.

Jennifer Schroeder and Kim Botto discuss doing children’s ministry with children of all personalities and temperaments. Kim discusses how the church has often done ministry in an exclusive way to kids with disabilities or sensitivities and suggests how we can become more inclusive. She offers insight to how leaders can create an environment of calm, being flexible to the needs that children may need, and curious to their needs.

Jennifer Schroeder talks with Robert and Lori Crosby about their work with children who have experienced trauma and how it shapes our work with them in ministry. They share what it looks like to think about ministry through a trauma-informed lens and why that approach fosters an environment that leads to feelings of safety and welcome in the church.
Website: https://reachhurtingkids.com
Book: Trauma-Informed Children's Ministry: A Practical Guide to Reaching Hurting Kids by Robert and Lori Crosby

Jennifer Schroeder talks with Tiffany Yecke Brooks about her upcoming book, To Rebehold the Stars, which talks about rebuilding your faith after deconstruction. In this podcast, she shares her insight to how people can navigate faith after deconstruction. She also discusses ways our churches can help others as they are going through deconstruction and how we can equip young people with resources to feel comfortable to ask questions when doubts arise. 
Website: tiffanyyeckebrooks.com